If MS Doesn't Break Win32 API support why migrate to DOT NET?

If MS Doesn't Break Win32 API support why migrate to DOT NET?

Post by Randall Pa » Sat, 08 Nov 2003 08:10:56


The question in the subject line is serious. If it ain't broke why
change it?

There are tons of open source and commercial VCL controls. Win32 exes
are smaller and faster. Why switch?

If we can't see a reason to do that then Borland ought to extend its
Win32 support for a longer period of time.

Does anyone think that in the next two OS releases from MS that they
will break Win32 API calls? Okay, maybe some esoteric calls might be
broken for security reasons. Heck, some stuff breaks as a result of
service paks changing the behavior of some call. But does anyone really
think MS will break Win32 API calls? I don't.
 
 
 

If MS Doesn't Break Win32 API support why migrate to DOT NET?

Post by Team » Sat, 08 Nov 2003 08:22:44


"Randall Parker" < XXXX@XXXXX.COM > wrote in



Not so much change, in terms of interfaces and such. But in behaviors, I'm
sure. Also, Microsoft stated that they won't be extending the Win32 API
anymore. With every new OS, there is new API features. That won't be the
case in Longhorn. .NET will be the new API, it will get all of the focus,
and Win32 will just be for backwards support.


Gambit

 
 
 

If MS Doesn't Break Win32 API support why migrate to DOT NET?

Post by Edward Die » Sat, 08 Nov 2003 08:48:37


I heavily doubt it. Changing behaviors of underlying Win32 calls, other than
maybe visually presenting something slightly different to represent advances
in visual rendering on Windows, would be suicidal for MS.
 
 
 

If MS Doesn't Break Win32 API support why migrate to DOT NET?

Post by OBone » Sat, 08 Nov 2003 09:52:36


Sure, but customers won't change as soon as Longhorn is out !
Fact is, half of our customers are still under Nt4 and as a result, we
can't use .Net at all with them. Asking them to update is out of
question so we stick to Win32...
 
 
 

If MS Doesn't Break Win32 API support why migrate to DOT NET?

Post by Randall Pa » Sat, 08 Nov 2003 11:56:01

Exactly. I deal with a big site that uses NT everywhere. I know people
who run Win9x still. I know a mid-sized ISP that has many Win boxes and
one quarter of their servers for hosting customer web sites are still on
NT. The other 3/4ths are on Win2k.

I can't imagine starting a .NET project in the next 3 years.
 
 
 

If MS Doesn't Break Win32 API support why migrate to DOT NET?

Post by Andrue Cop » Sat, 08 Nov 2003 18:19:19

Randall Parker,


Because it will gradually become obsolete and your applications will
face much the same fate.

Come on - this is the IT industry. Possibly the fastest moving
industry in the world and progress means adapting to the latest
technology. If we all adopted the suggestion implicit in your post
we'd still be time sharing mainframes at our local university and
uploading data on punched card.

Andrue Cope
[Bicester, UK]
 
 
 

If MS Doesn't Break Win32 API support why migrate to DOT NET?

Post by Randall Pa » Sun, 09 Nov 2003 01:20:48

Application obsolescence is judged by users. What is it about a .NET
application that will make it seem less obsolete?
 
 
 

If MS Doesn't Break Win32 API support why migrate to DOT NET?

Post by Andrue Cop » Sun, 09 Nov 2003 01:48:33

Randall Parker,


Functionality and display rendering.

Possibly also performance since last I heard Win32 was going to be
relegated to being subsystem and is presumably therefore going to add
an extra translation layer to function calls.
Andrue Cope
[Bicester, UK]
 
 
 

If MS Doesn't Break Win32 API support why migrate to DOT NET?

Post by Randall Pa » Sun, 09 Nov 2003 11:22:56

But it gets down to particular functionality. Most apps do not use most
of the functional categories in the operating system. For instance, I
write apps that have no need to do live video or network calls. So
enhancements in these areas are of no interest.

Performance: Current .NET is slower. It might in some future OS version
pull equal with Win32 - or maybe not. Going for a hypothetical
performance advantage that may never happen holds no allure.

MS wants us to go to the new APIs. That does not mean that we will
necessarily gain any advantage each case from doing so.
 
 
 

If MS Doesn't Break Win32 API support why migrate to DOT NET?

Post by Dave Jewel » Mon, 10 Nov 2003 04:31:11

"Randall Parker" < XXXX@XXXXX.COM > wrote in


[snipped]

You get my vote, Randall. The Win32 API will be with us until at least the
end of the decade -- probably longer. Note that you can still run DOS apps
on XP and -- guess what? -- I bet you'll be able to run 'em on LongHorn as
well. ;-))

Dave
 
 
 

If MS Doesn't Break Win32 API support why migrate to DOT NET?

Post by Dave Jewel » Mon, 10 Nov 2003 04:33:39


I'm

Please define "behaviors" Remy. It is self-evident that Microsoft won't do
anything that would break existing apps. Therefore, what do you mean by
"behaviors" ?


Do you really believe that? :-)) There are always new API calls. They
might not always be documented, but they are *always* there. Guaranteed.

Dave
 
 
 

If MS Doesn't Break Win32 API support why migrate to DOT NET?

Post by Dave Jewel » Mon, 10 Nov 2003 04:39:54


Did you know that Turbo Pascal 1.0 still works on XP? It's not pretty but
it works. :-)


I think you need to distinguish between (a) adapting the latest technology
on the one hand and (b) giving your customers what they perceive to be added
value on the other. An end-user running Word doesn't give a damn whether or
not it's a .NET app. He only cares that it's fast enough and does the job.

Dave
 
 
 

If MS Doesn't Break Win32 API support why migrate to DOT NET?

Post by Dave Jewel » Mon, 10 Nov 2003 04:41:24


Errrr...... you *do* know that GDI+ is implemented at the Win32 level, do
you?

Dave


Not for a long time......

Dave
 
 
 

If MS Doesn't Break Win32 API support why migrate to DOT NET?

Post by Randall Pa » Mon, 10 Nov 2003 05:30:57

Dave,

What too many people seem to forget is that the apps are worth more than
the OS and that a large part of the value of the OS comes from all the
apps that can run on it.

Corps are not going to spend huge amounts of money migrating masses of
internal apps to a new set of OS APIs just because MS wants to deprecate
the old ones. The longevity of so many apps that run for decades and
even the continued use of mainframes in order to run ancient legacy apps
demonstrates this.

MS and the other OS vendors know this. It is a lot easier to add than it
is to take away.
 
 
 

If MS Doesn't Break Win32 API support why migrate to DOT NET?

Post by Dave Jewel » Mon, 10 Nov 2003 06:56:33

"Randall Parker" < XXXX@XXXXX.COM > wrote in



Exactly. Lots of people seem to think that "deprecate" means "remove". I
don't doubt that Microsoft want us to move to .NET, and I don't doubt that
Borland want us to buy their new .NET development tools (<g>), but I am also
very sure that I could profitably be using Delphi 7 for many years to come.

Dave