PMView's stable - IT IS STABLE!

PMView's stable - IT IS STABLE!

Post by Herwig Bau » Tue, 07 Oct 2003 15:04:17

i there,

as I am one these guys who bought one of the the so called lifetime
licenses for PMView 0.xx *and* now relicensed PMView 3.0 I would like to
explain why I did this and why it makes perfect sense to do so.

First of all, there were some thesis discussed here and I 'd like to
comment on these:

1.) PMView Pro 3.0 is essentially the same as PMView 2000 2.0

Well, if one only takes a short glance at both programs, it might easily
appear this way. On the first glance everything looks the same.

BUT there are numerous little features that are so damn useful for heavy
daily use in 3.0 that are missing in 2.0, especially if you own a
digital camera (like I do). And for some of these tasks there is simply
no other solution on OS/2 (eCS).

So before claiming Pro 3.0 is essentially the same as 2000 2.0 you have
to make *use* of the new features in order to like them (and in order to
miss them in 2000 2.0).

2.) The price is too high for these features

I am self employed and I am calculating this way: PMView Pro 3.0 gives
me tools to accomplish tasks very fast (partly much faster and better
than 2000 2.0, partly unavailable before.). This saves me a lot of time
in heavy daily usage. The value of the time Pro 3.0 saved me during the
last weeks is definitely a lot higher, than the 40 bucks (€ or $ or
whatever) I payed for the license.

Also compared with other update prices in the OS/2 (eCS) scene, it seems
fair (IMHO). The price/value I get from SWC/PA these days is worse for
sure. However I acknowledge, this is a very subjective view.

3.) There are solutions on the Windows platform that are free and are
equal or better.

This is true, at least in some respect. My digicam came with PhotoShop
Elements and NikonView, and there is IRFanView. These 3 supersede the
feature set of PMView Pro 3.0, they do definitely, no discussion
required about that.

Despite the fact that I either have to boot into Windows (which for
obvious reasons is definitely not my favorite option) for NikonView or
at least fire up a VPC Guest (for PhotoShop Elements) or use Odin for
IRFanView (the complete feature set of PMView still does *not* *work* on
Odin reliably), I would have to use 3 (or at least 2) programs to
accomplish the tasks.

PMView Pro 3.0 once again prooves as a time saver for me.

What is more, compared with the above solutions on Windows PMView is
super easy, fast and conveniant to use ("Do (almost) everything in one

Both PhotoShop Elements and IRFanView are quite complicated and not
intuitive, especially for simple tasks that I do very often.

IMHO PMView is simply a very good software. However this is true for
both 2000 2.0 and Pro 3.0.

4. PMView Pro 3.0 is not stable

My popuplog.os2 does not show a single trap of PMView 3.0 since I use it
(a month or so) now. And I use it heavily on a daily basis (as I said,
for my digicam) and as a browser for FaxWorks fax files.

If I encountered a problem (I did with 2000 2.0), I get in contact with
Peter and he fixes the problem (he will remember the flyover help
problem I reported to him and which was not so easy to fix, but he did

I really appreciate Peter's support.


So, in summary, for me there is not the slightest doubt, that an upgrade
to PMView 3.0 can be recommended at least to anybody using a digicam.

It is really pity that unreasonable drivel from some wellknown persons
in this group

PMView's stable - IT IS STABLE!

Post by Andreas Lu » Tue, 07 Oct 2003 16:08:15

I fully support everything you wrote, Herwig. For sure, there are
applications with more/other features (both under OS/2 and of course
windows), but this is not a result of incompetence of Peter to implement
bloat feature number xyz, but it's due to the enormous time Peter invests in
doing every feature RIGHT - if it makes sense for a picture VIEWER app, make
it easily accessible, complete and STABLE. Most notably, PMView's file format
support works for all the various subformats and for very large files without
problems. (If you were in the beta testing group you knew how much careful
consideration went into EVERY little feature implemented in PMView). PLUS:
Peter's support is simply the best that I experienced anywhere!

As a consequence I use PMView as my picture viewer/scanning app exclusively,
even under windows. IMHO, it's worth every little cent. (And the upgrade to
3.0 PRO brought skripting and EXIF support, among many other things - well
worth the upgrade price)




Andreas Ludwig
directly from Vienna
using PMINews 2 on eCS 1.01 German!


PMView's stable - IT IS STABLE!

Post by James J. W » Wed, 08 Oct 2003 07:38:28


Could you please enumerate some of the new features that you find useful
for digital camera work that are not present in 2.0?

Unfortunately, both I and my son have found version 3 slower than
version 2 on almost everything. I am perfectly prepared to believe that
this is due to configuration problems, but what are they? Since you get
faster performance, can you offer any suggestions on what options to use
to achieve this better performance?

This saves me a lot of time
One new feature that I know about that I find worth the price by itself
is the lossless JPEG rotation.

I have had no stability problems with the new version either.

I too had problems with earlier versions and Peter was extremely
responsive. I certainly agree that onyone in the OS/2 community that
has any use for PMView should support Peter by buying his product.

PMView's stable - IT IS STABLE!

Post by The OS/2 G » Wed, 08 Oct 2003 07:55:02

And any answer you offer does not justify your purchase because
Peter Nielson conned OS/2 users into buying his PMView 0.xx
by telling them they would receive a lifetime license to all future

And like the fool you show yourself to be, you bent over, spread
your cheeks and said "let me pay for the screw" and you did just
that so you could get the latest greatest gift from a con artist. You
walk funny and we all know why.

Stupid people do stupid things.

People have become so blinded by the unethical business tactics
ingrained in so many by Microsoft that they "bend right over" when
a vendor baits them with false advertising then turns around
and claims 'I lied. Here's what Im really offering..". In America we
call that the good old "bait and switch". Mustang did it as did SPG,
Stardock, Serenity and now Nielsen. There is no faster way to
kill a 'niche' product then to lie to 'niche' customers.

If you like getting screwed then continue to support this kind of
'standard Microsoft business behavior'. It's your money. Pour
it down the gutter if doing so makes you believe your farts don't

PMView Pro has problems whereas PMView does not despite
those who claim otherwise. I advise people to stick with PMView
and let Peter stew in his PMViewPro problems and false advertising.

Tim Martin, The OS/2 Guy
Warp City Web Site -
From his Warp 4.53 ThinkPad T40 w/2GIG of RAM,
80GIG of Hard Disk and IBM's Web Browser for OS/2

PMView's stable - IT IS STABLE!

Post by Wayn » Wed, 08 Oct 2003 07:57:32

I have found nothing new that affects the features I use. In fact I only
use it to look at the photos I (rarely) take or screenshots off the net.
I installed it side-by-side with PMView 2000 and took it off in less
than a day.

So I should rush out and upgrade even though PMView 2000 is still
working? Perhaps I should also buy a new TV even though the one
I have works? I think not! In the past I've bought stuff for OS/2 because
I wanted to support the author but those days are long gone, now if
someone wants my money he's go to give me value. I see no value
in spending another $40 on a product that already cost me $42 and
doesn't offer anything over what I already have (for my needs) The
slimey tactic of not telling anyone that their lifetime licence was no
longer valid until AFTER wasting time downloading and installing
it was another reason why I would not upgrade nor ever purchase
a product from Peter again.

Posted with PMINews 2 for OS/2
Running on eComStation 1.1 (Warp 5)

PMView's stable - IT IS STABLE!

Post by Winfried T » Wed, 08 Oct 2003 15:59:04

On Mon, 6 Oct 2003 22:38:28 UTC, "James J. Weinkam" < XXXX@XXXXX.COM >

Well the functions I use most in combination with my digital camera

1) Lossless JPEG-rotation
2) Saving EXIF-information while converting the image
3) Quickscripts
4) Quickscripts
5) Quickscripts
6) Viewing EXIF-information

None of these are present in version 2.0. I use quickscripts a lot and
they save me a lot of time.


"If anything existed, it could not be known"
(Gorgias) ~wtilanus/

PMView's stable - IT IS STABLE!

Post by Herwig Bau » Wed, 08 Oct 2003 16:43:56

James J. Weinkam schrieb:

- JPEG Lossless rotation
- scripting capability (or better macro capability)
- EXIF information recognition

You misunderstood me. I did not mean to claim that PMView Pro
is faster than older versions, in fact I don't know, for me
there is no noticable difference.

Here is an example of what I meant:

I go and take 200 pictures with my digicam. Approximately 50%
of them are in portrait mode.

In PMView 2000 I have to load each portrait pic, rotate it and
save it again (and loose quality by doing so). For 100 pics I
probably need more them 45 minutes.

In PMView Pro I define a socalled QuickScript to do a lossless
JPEG rotation. This QuickScript appears in the context menu of
the open files dialogue. All I have to do now is select all
portrait pics, right click ad execute the QuickScript. 2 minutes
later (or so, depends on hardware) all pics are done (without
loosing quality).

With faster I meant the difference in working time for me
(45 min versus 2 min).



PMView's stable - IT IS STABLE!

Post by Herwig Bau » Wed, 08 Oct 2003 16:44:04

Hi Tim,

Then you either did not read my message or did not understand it.
PMview Pro is a big time saver for me and that makes it worth the
40 bucks. Please read the scenario I describe in the msg to
James J. Weinkam and you will understand. My reasoning is simple

Which certainly was a bad idea, because this must lead into
discussions as we have them here now. In addition it is bad
for both the users and for the author. For the users because
they get frustated if they have to pay again or stay with an
outdated software and for the author because no money means
decreasing motivation. This is basic psychology, nothing more
nothing less.

My point of view is: People who work make mistakes. People
who do not work do not make mistakes.

Peter made a mistake with the lifetime license, I am sure he
knows that. I prefer to forgive him (and re license), as I
prefer people to forgive me my mistakes.

Crusades usually lead nowhere...
You are jumping to conclusions. :-)

Please, if you are unable to lead the discussion on a reasonable
level without trying to insult me, then you have lost that
thread anyway.

Which one? Describe it to me. I would gladly try to reproduce

which perfect makes sense if you do not own a digital camera,
but not otherwise.


PMView's stable - IT IS STABLE!

Post by Andreas Lu » Wed, 08 Oct 2003 18:23:24

Why do you use a quickscript here? Shouldn't do the 'JPEG Rotate' options do
exactly the same? Even more, there is an option 'Lossless using EXIF
information' - so maybe even selecting the right images is not necessary...
(Unfortunately, all pictures I get to put to the WWW have top-left set as
orientation, even if they are in portrait mode, so this might be a feature
for highend cameras).




Andreas Ludwig
directly from Vienna
using PMINews 2 on eCS 1.01 German!

PMView's stable - IT IS STABLE!

Post by Winfried T » Wed, 08 Oct 2003 19:14:45

On Tue, 7 Oct 2003 09:23:24 UTC, "Andreas Ludwig" < XXXX@XXXXX.COM >

At least my camera, a canon powershot A70, doesn't have a sensor for
the orientation.


"If anything existed, it could not be known"
(Gorgias) ~wtilanus/

PMView's stable - IT IS STABLE!

Post by pnielse » Wed, 08 Oct 2003 22:03:51

Correct! If PMView 2000 works fine, there is NO REASON to upgrade!!!

This is one of the main reasons for the "Pro" in the name and for
charging for the upgrade. Only the ones who need the new features need
to pay. Nobody is forced into upgrading as I still fully support
PMView 2000.

Just for reference, there is one customer that is still buying a few
new copies of the very old "PMView v1.0" (1997) from us every six
months or so. They are happy with it and still buy new licenses at $42
each (i.e. $2.05 more than PMView Pro! Isn't that amazing...)

As an image viewer, nothing much has chaged between PMView 2000 and
PMView Pro. Faster interpolation for GHz machines and "old jpeg tiff
suppport" are the only two real improvements in image viewing that I
can think of. Not many people really need these features, or notice
the difference, that's for sure.

The big differences are in the features that are needed in a
"professional" environment. Here are two very obvious tasks:
-Batch printing. PMView Pro can print 1000 images in one click. In
PMView 2000 you have to open them one by one and print them one by
-Batch conversion. PMView Pro lets you set up custom defined quick
scripts that let you transform colors, rotate, etc. PMView 2000 can
only do format conversion in batch, nothing more.

There will be more features in the v3.xx series. However, feel free to
hold your purchase until there are features that you need! No need to
rush into purchasing something that does not give you more value.
PMView 2000 works fine and so does PMView Pro. If you don't see
anything new, stick to PMView 2000!

As a side note, I understand you very well. In Finland, people keep
their TV sets to keep it at least for 10 years on average. If it
breaks down, it is repaired. Usually TV-sets are never thrown away,
unless it is too expensive to repair them. Here in the US, I am amazed
about the fact that so many people don't even know that electronics
can be fixed. If a cheap TV-set breaks down, you buy a new one. This
really shows too. I was amazed that my Panasonic cordless phone only
came with a 30 day warranty. In Finland, this would probably be
illegal. Even cheap electronics comes with at least half a year
warranty. Even after the warranty has expired, most finns would
probably try to get the equipment fixed and only buy new equipment if
it turns out that it is too expensive to get it fixed...

Peter Nielsen
[Author of PMView]

PMView's stable - IT IS STABLE!

Post by Christian » Wed, 08 Oct 2003 22:12:43

On Mon, 6 Oct 2003 22:38:28 UTC, "James J. Weinkam" < XXXX@XXXXX.COM >

Hm, actually I find that PMView Pro loads faster than PMView 2000 here.

Have a look at Preferences -> Display and the options "Use resampling
when scaling" and "Resampling method". Resampling improves the display
quality of scaled images a lot, but also takes a good amount of
computing power. Try deactivating it or selecting "Standard" as
"Resampling method".

The same applies to "Use smooth keyboard scrolling" on the same page.

Finally, I don't know what kind of optimization Peter uses, and what
kind of CPU you have.
"In the beginning, the Universe was created. This has made a lot of
people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move." - Douglas

PMView's stable - IT IS STABLE!

Post by pnielse » Wed, 08 Oct 2003 22:16:14


PMView's stable - IT IS STABLE!

Post by Herwig Bau » Wed, 08 Oct 2003 22:22:05

Andreas Ludwig schrieb:

Blush! I overlooked this one. Didn't I say the new features were not obvious :-)

My camera, a Nikon 4300, does not have this sensor either.


PMView's stable - IT IS STABLE!

Post by Mark Dode » Wed, 08 Oct 2003 23:41:36

On Tue, 7 Oct 2003 07:44:04 UTC, Herwig Bauernfeind


If you must reply to this troll, please put [FUD4] in the subject so
those who find his FUD offensive can filter it. See for details. Better yet ignore the troll.


From the eComStation of Mark Dodel
Warpstock 2003, San Francisco, October 18-19th -