SC4: Any way to hide or window the screen?

SC4: Any way to hide or window the screen?

Post by Will Deatr » Sun, 27 Jul 2003 08:18:55


Hi Z:

Are you referring to Strategic Conquest 4? It opens in full screen
mode, but I am able to shrink the window by dragging the control handle
in the lower right. I am running SC4 in Classic mode on a Mac G4 with
OS 10.2.6

Will


In article <240720031033088944% XXXX@XXXXX.COM >, Zeph
 
 
 

SC4: Any way to hide or window the screen?

Post by slavin » Tue, 29 Jul 2003 07:34:52

In article <bfq9n6$ XXXX@XXXXX.COM >,



/Nobody/ is going to make the SimCity 3000 mistake a second time.
SC4K is a proper port, not an emulation. Don't worry on that
score. However, I too am interested to know if SC4K is a good
game or not. I've read the reviews but I don't know if it will
actually keep me amused for more than 15 hours.

 
 
 

SC4: Any way to hide or window the screen?

Post by Michael Em » Tue, 29 Jul 2003 09:49:29

in article XXXX@XXXXX.COM , Simon Slavin at
XXXX@XXXXX.COM @localhost wrote on 7/27/03 3:34 PM:


That is kind of a problem with SC, isn't it? Seems to me that the designers
have written the game so that the player is compelled to pursue growth until
every inch is developed and pollution of all kinds is rampant. And still the
voters want more.

This is kind of a distopic view of things, isn't it? I don't know, it may be
valid, but I can find all of that I want without having to pay for a game.
I'd like to have an SC with more evolutionary options.

Michael
 
 
 

SC4: Any way to hide or window the screen?

Post by nebus » Thu, 31 Jul 2003 22:39:50

Michael Emrys < XXXX@XXXXX.COM > writes:





That was always one of the game design problems from SimCity 1
through 3,000 (the numbering doens't make strict sense, does it?). A
further problem -- understandable for the first versions, forgieable for
the second, but pretty awkward by the time they got to 3000 -- was that
a road at a diagonal ate up four blocks, rather than two, with the rest
of the space wasted (I don't think it even improved property values as
"green space"), and that the slightest incline made it impossible for
anyone to build anything.

The result is the only logical city design was a relentlessly
followed square grid on a completely flat terrain, with every feature
of the local geography squashed out. Unless you try *** variants
like single-road cities... I saw the Mac SimCity 4 in the store, but
held off on buying it until I hear some reviews. (And, also, until the
Apple store gets around to shipping Europa Universalis II to me. At
the moment they figure it'll surely go out by August 8. Thanks for
saving me the time of going back to the store checking for it, gang.)
Maybe the gameplay'll be more realistic.

Joseph Nebus
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SC4: Any way to hide or window the screen?

Post by Michael Em » Thu, 31 Jul 2003 23:37:46

in article XXXX@XXXXX.COM , Joseph Nebus at
XXXX@XXXXX.COM wrote on 7/30/03 6:39 AM:


Yeah, I had forgotten about that.

Well, in SC 2000 I always built up one end of my map as mountains with a
giant river coming down one side and lots of trees all over the place. I
would put a humongous number of dams across the river, which would solve my
power problem until fusion came along, and the nice scenery would help the
tourist industry and cut down on pollution a little.

But the actual urban areas were squares with lots of streets so that nearly
every inch was accessable. The few corners that weren't I filled with parks.
I would try to intersperse residential with commercial to try to keep
commuting to a minimum, but I never really found out if that helped. I had
to build a lot of freeways anyway. Industry was always a problem. I had to
have lots of it for jobs, but it tended to pollute like crazy. I would zone
for light industry fairly near to residential, and heavy industry further
out of town, but there was never any real solution. Opting for
anti-pollution laws helped.

Michael
 
 
 

SC4: Any way to hide or window the screen?

Post by Matt McLeo » Fri, 01 Aug 2003 12:32:39


It also rather forced the excessive use of cars. Admittedly this is
pretty much the US model (yes, I know usable PT exists in some limited
areas), but the US isn't the whole world and things are done differently
elsewhere.

That used to really annoy the hell out of me. I could build a wonderful
rail system and it'd go unused while the residents clamoured for more roads.

--
"Give away the gerbil, sell the gaffer tape."
-- Jai < XXXX@XXXXX.COM > on Open Source business models
 
 
 

SC4: Any way to hide or window the screen?

Post by Michael Em » Fri, 01 Aug 2003 17:13:13

in article XXXX@XXXXX.COM , Matt McLeod at
XXXX@XXXXX.COM wrote on 7/30/03 8:32 PM:


Yeah, that bugged me too.

But again, the root problem IMO is the inability of the player to set or
change the ruling assumptions of the game.

Michael
 
 
 

SC4: Any way to hide or window the screen?

Post by slavin » Sun, 03 Aug 2003 08:33:43

In article <BB4D264A.13C67% XXXX@XXXXX.COM >,



Yes, hydro-power really was the key to SC2K, wasn't it. And
the same water that was supplying the power was also scenic enough
to offset the small amount of pollution produced.


I developed a 9x9 grid with houses, shops or industry around the
outside and a police station, hospital, park, or fire station in
the inside. It didn't seem to matter that the firemen couldn't
drive any closer to their station than four squares away.


It did. Roads generated pollution proportional to the number of
trips on them. You could see different amounts of cars on each
road and this reflected how much pollution the road generated.
I had a very placid town which got struck with a disaster once,
causing everyone who drove east-west to have to drive in the
north. Until I repaired the east-west roads in the south I had
terrible pollution in the north even though I had no more
industry there.


Well congratulations for having discovered how it's done in real
life. Shows that the underlying simulation is accurate.
 
 
 

SC4: Any way to hide or window the screen?

Post by Michael Em » Sun, 03 Aug 2003 11:30:12

in article XXXX@XXXXX.COM , Simon Slavin at
XXXX@XXXXX.COM @localhost wrote on 8/1/03 4:33 PM:


AIR, I too put the city services in the middle of the neighborhoods, but I
gave them roads too. The centering was just to get the maximum coverage from
each fire and police station. I also put schools and hospitals there.


Up to a point. As I posted a few days ago, I have the stong conviction that
in many ways the designers have narrowed the options more than exist in the
real world, sometimes by a considerable margin. Maybe this was originally
done to keep the chore of programming it all down to a managable size, or
maybe their understanding of the realities just hadn't expanded beyond that
point. But in any case, I would like to see them revisit the concept and
enlarge it.

Michael
 
 
 

SC4: Any way to hide or window the screen?

Post by Michael Em » Mon, 04 Aug 2003 01:56:53

in article XXXX@XXXXX.COM , Joseph Nebus at
XXXX@XXXXX.COM wrote on 8/2/03 8:42 AM:


Maybe they've gone into real time? Lol.

Michael
 
 
 

SC4: Any way to hide or window the screen?

Post by Michael Em » Mon, 04 Aug 2003 13:41:51

in article XXXX@XXXXX.COM , Simon Slavin at
XXXX@XXXXX.COM @localhost wrote on 8/2/03 4:13 PM:



That would be one way to describe it I suppose.


I was thinking more in terms of what the sims population would ask for and
what they would tolerate, their preferences and priorities. Right now as the
game exists, those are rigidly locked to certain numbers. I think a set of
sliders would be nice.


Now you're getting complicated. :-)

I guess for the first iteration, I'd keep it simple and you would pick
parameters (or go with default) at start and stick with them throughout the
game. Then maybe if the game's designers were ready to tackle a deeper
simulation, you could have those parameters evolve as game time passes.

Michael
 
 
 

SC4: Any way to hide or window the screen?

Post by nebus » Tue, 05 Aug 2003 01:14:01


XXXX@XXXXX.COM @localhost (Simon Slavin) writes:





Well, sure -- why not? There are a bunch of parameters that go
into the game, that are unavoidable parts of the simulation but don't
need to be hard-coded. Just sticking to societal matters you could say
people will voluntarily walk <x> blocks before resorting to cars; or
will put up with waits of <y> minutes for a bus or subway before going
back to driving; or will accept <z> pollution for <w> jobs, and so on.
Somebody who lives in Manhattan puts up with more crowds and noise than
someone living in Albany does; why can't the flexibility in those be
simulated?



There're a couple ways to do it. You could have it be an options
screen set at the beginning, just as you set the terrain and difficulty
level and so on. Maybe you could reset the panel during the game, though
it'd probably be more fun to have those parameters vary during the game --
so you can control them partly by advertising campaigns and the like, but
they'll also develop based on what the longtime Sims see as "normal" ...
which would probably be a great improvement on the game. It'd become a
new driving force changing how optimal the older parts of the city are,
and give you something to do besides building the new fringes of town.

Joseph Nebus
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SC4: Any way to hide or window the screen?

Post by slavin » Wed, 06 Aug 2003 08:46:33

In article < XXXX@XXXXX.COM >,



Have a look at the review in www.macgamer.com. It has at least
one screenshot showing that.
 
 
 

SC4: Any way to hide or window the screen?

Post by nebus » Wed, 06 Aug 2003 23:16:52


XXXX@XXXXX.COM @localhost (Simon Slavin) writes:





Hm. Well, at least it looks like they produce green space and
only slightly catastrophic traffic intersections, based on
http://www.yqcomputer.com/


Most of the game looks rather nice, although I'm baffled by the
warning signs flashed in
http://www.yqcomputer.com/

It appears to be saying those zones have no attache cases, which
isn't ordinarily something the civic government has to handle.

Joseph Nebus
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SC4: Any way to hide or window the screen?

Post by Michael Em » Wed, 06 Aug 2003 23:53:46

in article XXXX@XXXXX.COM , Joseph Nebus at
XXXX@XXXXX.COM wrote on 8/5/03 7:16 AM:



That definitely *looks* better than 2k. I might could get interested in
this.


What do attachcases usually signify?

Another anomaly can be seen in the sidewalks. I notice that certain
intersections of sidewalks have a little green cutout. The ones in the upper
part of the screen look like they are properly alligned, but the rest don't.
I wonder whether that's a bug or just that whoever was building the city
messed up.

Michael